re: new scout 800 owner

[bearbvd@domain.elided (Greg Hermann)]

>Greg Hermann <bearbvd@domain.elided> wrote:
>> >I know that my engine probably doesn't have the hardened valve seats,
>>
>> I have NEVER seen a Binder engine that did NOT have hard,
>replaceable seats
>> for the exhaust valves, and only a few , later model year engines
>that did
>> not ALSO have seats for the intakes!!
>
>Greg,
>
>I must have gotten confused along the way here... I've been hearing
>for years that prior to 1979, the Binders didn't have hardened valve
>seats, and relied on the tetraethyl lead additive to form a good seal.
> Is this intake only, or pure myth?  Or am I just plain confused?
>
>Can you take what you said about the valves and apply it to the
>situation we were talking about?  Do you mean to say that I will never
>get my exhaust valves to seat tighter, and that I will always have
>this backfiring upon downshifting even if I rebuild the heads in the
>'proper' manner?

The sixties vintage small block Binder engines , at least all that I have
ever looked inside, all had hard valve seats in both the intakes and the
exhausts. Sometime, early to mid seventies, IH got a little cheaper, and
built some heads with no seats in the intakes of 304's and 345's. I have
NEVER, EVER seen a 266/304/345/392 (or 152/196) head that did not have seat
inserts for its exhaust valves, as new,  from the factory!

There were plenty of other American engines which were not built with hard
valve seat inserts in their heads, and which finally started either using
seats or induction hardening the exhaust valve seat area of their head
castings after they HAD to because of the move to unleaded fuel. But--this
was NEVER true, to my knowlege, with IH engines! Also, as far as I know,
IHC always used the ultra-premium quality exhaust valves in all of their
small blocks. Remember--these engines were designed for use in trucks up to
about 45,000 lbs. GVW rating--and they WERE ALL built to stand up to that
kind of use! It's not like dealing with a Dodge, Ford, or Chebby, where you
had better make sure you have the "heavy truck" heads and the "heavy truck"
block if you are going to put an engine into that kind of service! For any
of us old enough to remember the 152T Scout 80's--I believe that all IH did
was install their existing (export) low compression head and pistons, and
bolt on a turbo. No other changes needed for the engine to live, just fine
thank you.

In fact, while I am ranting, adding a turbo might be a wonderful answer for
a 196!!

If your engine is popping through the exhausts, I would take a hard look at
the valve springs (these  lose tension with age, and frequently break) as
well as at the cam and lifters, which frequently wear out, sometimes just
on one lobe. The late type rockers are definitely better, and you might
also check to make sure that you do not have any bent pushrods! I prefer to
run one of the Delco (cast iron) distributors. One of my reasons for this
is that you can get an adjustable vacuum advance can to fit it (it uses the
same tune-up parts as for a Chevy window type Delco). These engines like a
good deal MORE vacuum advance than IH ever set them up with, and it is
surprising how much their highway mileage can be improved with a more
aggressive vacuum advance curve! Plus, more vacuum advance when you back
off can help with any popping--although I am inclined to think that the
popping is on account of valve float.

I have a strong suspicion that the rumors about soft valve seats may have
originated with rip-off artist machinists with (60 Minutes watcher,
Consumer Reports reader type) customers who did not know any better, maybe
who had parroted the stories about valve recession problems on other motors
when using unleaded fuel, and who got charged for putting in the valve
seats that were already there in the head in the first place!! (Clean it
up, point, and say "SEE__ I put these nice valve seats in for you--here's
what you owe me!"

And there's always a good supply of new sponson rods on the shelf in the
back room, too!!!

Regards,

Greg---NAHHH-I'm not a cynic at all!
>
>Thanks,
>
>David
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